"Who will be First to Cop the Carbon Chop?"

Carbon Sense Newsletter from Carbon Sense Coalition
11 September 2011

A print-ready copy of this issue of "Carbon Sense" can be downloaded from link in title.

billions of dollars to overseas carbon shysters
It is not possible to achieve the government's planned cuts to the production of carbon dioxide without significant shrinkage of our main industries.

There are only two ways to achieve their unrealistic emission reduction targets.

The destructive but honest way is to allow the shrinking targets and rising taxes to force closures or relocation for our backbone industries.

The dishonest way is to pay billions of dollars to overseas carbon shysters who, in return for our bribes, "promise" to make the reductions on our behalf. This will achieve nothing except pauperisation of Australians.

The tax apologists will claim - 'but the tax only applies to the top 500 polluters'. Every company hit with the carbon tax must pass it on to all those who use their products. Soon every industry and consumer will feel the costs, even if they do not understand the sneaky mechanism.

People who think the cuts can occur painlessly have not looked at the hard facts of our industries.

It's not possible to make steel without generating carbon dioxide. No carbon tax can change that.

It's not possible to make cement or brew beer without generating carbon dioxide.

It's not possible to generate electricity using brown coal, black coal, diesel or gas without generating carbon dioxide.

It's is not possible to run a car, truck, train, tractor, ship or plane on oil, gas, diesel or petrol without generating carbon dioxide.  Even electric cars, trains and elevators get their energy mainly from coal or gas. As for wind power, 70% of its "capacity" will be delivered by the backup gas facilities, all producing carbon dioxide.

Cattle, sheep, goats and pigs cannot live without generating carbon dioxide. (Even humans must exhale occasionally.)

The Australian government plans to reduce the production of harmless carbon dioxide by 5% (or maybe 25%) by 2050, despite increasing population.

Which industry will be first to cop the carbon chop? They should start by blocking all emissions from Parliament House.

Or is the carbon tax just about grabbing a new source of government revenue?

How to Solve the Global Warming Crisis –
Stop Breathin'

For those who like rap music, have a listen to an anti-carbon tax tune:


Climate Change Reconsidered.

A comprehensive new report on all aspects of the climate change debate written by serious and qualified scientists has just been published. According to the new report, “natural causes are very likely to be the dominant” cause of climate change that took place in the twentieth and at the start of the twenty-first centuries.  “We are not saying anthropogenic greenhouse gases (GHG) cannot produce some warming or have not in the past. Our conclusion is that the evidence shows they are not playing a substantial role.”

The authors of the new report go on to say “the net effect of continued warming and rising carbon dioxide concentrations in the atmosphere is most likely to be beneficial to humans, plants, and wildlife.”  For an Executive summary see:

Anti-Carbon Tax Rally, Perth.

The next big anti-carbon tax rally will be held in Perth. Pls come along or pass the invitation on to someone who can attend. The rally will be held on Sunday, Sept. 18th, at Langley Park on the Perth foreshore starting at 2 pm. A leaflet can be downloaded from:

 Will a Carbon Tax stop our Natural Disasters?
Australia's carbon tax will have NO HOPE of changing the climate of the world or of Australia. It is thus either just costly symbolism or destructive waste, probably both.

Does anyone seriously believe a carbon tax would have reduced the damage and lives lost in the Victorian bushfires? Would it have diverted Cyclone Yasi or reduced the Brisbane floods? No, in fact the reverse. By taxing the community and then wasting the proceeds on purchasing foreign tax credits, funding handouts to UN hangers-on or building new climate bureaucracies the community is deprived of funds that could have been used for better roads, emergency helicopters, flood proof airports, higher bridges or drought proof water supplies.

Read what Professor Bob Carter had to say on this subject to the “Convoy of No Confidence” protest in Canberra on August 22, 2011:

Jo Nova has the last word "Only an idiot would think a tax will change the weather". See:

Authorised by Viv Forbes
The Carbon Sense Coalition

“Carbon Sense” is a newsletter produced by the Carbon Sense Coalition, an Australian based organisation which opposes waste of resources, opposes pollution, and promotes the rational and sustainable use of carbon energy and carbon food.

Please spread “Carbon Sense” around.

For more information visit our web site at www.carbon-sense.com
Literary, financial or other contributions to help our cause are welcomed.

Chairman Viv Forbes MS 23, Rosewood   Qld   4340   Australia.   info@carbon-sense.com


  1. Sorry to be the one to have to let you in on a small secret...
    Where you have written "It is not possible to ...", you need to make a minor correction: "It is possible to..."

    This may require some further amendments to the articles conclusions, but I will leave those for you to work out for yourself.


  2. You seem to be a scientific genius, anonymous. If you think that it is possible to make steel without generating carbon dioxide, why not let the world in on your secret....or is it that you know how to make cement or brew beer without generating carbon dioxide?

    Gee, how flat would life be if beer didn't have those bubbles of carbon dioxide, or for that matter cola or any carbonated soft drink.

    Are you confining that world to that flat idea, anonymous?

    Perhaps your new version of the flat earth society?

  3. I see that the Inuit have been out again with their blowdryers heating the Arctic to a new record low volume, area and extent, was was the natural warming the "No Idea panel carbon cretins" NIPCC came up with ?

  4. I didn't see anything in the post about Arctic Ice? I didn't see anything in the post about the NIPCC report. Unless you want to comment on the actual post, JB, I will not publish your comments again.

  5. Geoff,

    Thanks for the vote of confidence- ("You seem to be a scientific genius, anonymous. If you think that it is possible to make steel without generating carbon dioxide, why not let the world in on your secret") -but I can't take any credit. Google: "Direct Reduced Iron".
    "The investment and operating costs of direct reduction plants are low compared to integrated steel plants and are more suitable for many developing countries where supplies of coking coal are limited." (Wikipedia) Note that it was the rising cost of coking coal that led to BlueScope sacking 1,000+ workers. Natural gas prices are falling. BlueScope's problems are down to it making a bad call on technology.

    Thermal decomposition of limestone for cement, and electricity production from coal and gas can be carried out in a number of ways with either little or no carbon dioxide emissions. Eg. Use hydrogen derived from coal or gas, etc, etc...
    The amount of CO2 released in beer production is trivial. Even so, equipment is available to collect it and sell it as food-grade CO2 for a profit.


  6. Direct reduced iron: Alternative iron source produced by heating an iron ore (generally having 65 to 70 percent iron) at a temperature high enough to burn off its carbon and oxygen content (a process called reduction) but below iron's melting point(1535°C or 2795°F). Since the reduction process consumes prodigious amounts of natural gas, it is economically viable only where natural gas is abundant and relatively cheap (such as in Trinidad & Tobago).

  7. Oh dear, Geoff, you seem to have fallen into cherry-picking statements.
    Wikipedia: "Supplies of powdered ore and raw natural gas are both available in areas such as Northern Australia, avoiding transport costs for the gas", "India is the world’s largest producer of direct-reduced iron, a vital constituent of the steel industry."
    And we really shouldn't leave out the excellent research by CSIRO into solar thermal gasification, lending itself to the production of Syngas (CO + H2) from common old thermal coal. BlueScope could have saved a mint on coking coal, but innovation gets short shrift in many large Australian companies. They prefer to waste money on advertising to try to make technology stand still.

  8. Cherry Picking? From some-one who relies on the CSIRO? Oh dear...

  9. "Anonymous said...I see that the Inuit have been out again with their blowdryers heating the Arctic to a new record low volume, area and extent, was was...."

    When was was that, Anonymous? Was was that back in 2007? Was was that when you were talking about the inuits with their blowdryers?

    See: http://www.real-science.com/uncategorized/arctic-sea-ice-continues-recover

    "Every year since 2007 has had more ice than 2007. Our friends describe this as a record low."

    Was was you one of "our friends?"

  10. Here's a post that shows your claim of record low artctic ice is a cherry picked result -
    "The LSM found one obscure source to claim a record low, and that was all they needed. All of their previously trusted data sources were no longer relevant."

  11. Geoff " record low artcitc ice"

    No , i was referring to the Arctic geoff,

    Bremer has the highest resolution of all sat. sources, this is acknowledged by NSIDC.

  12. Well, JB, you are a constant denier, aren't you? But then so is Bremer - see
    2011 Ice Is 9% Higher Than The Same Date In 2007
    So why is Bremen claiming a record low? Enquiring minds want to know.

    and then see:

    Dessler did peer-review in six weeks. Bremen did it in 20 seconds. (ps Dessler got in wrong anyway, but that's another story)

  13. Capture CO2 from beer brewing (save $23 per tonne in carbon tax) then sell it for $20-$40 per kilogram as food-grade CO2....

    "Logichem has more than 10 years experience in Carbon Dioxide (CO2) Collection Plants. This is essentially a CO2 Recovery Plant. The CO2 is recovered from fermenting and CO2 rich chemical processes. Logichem offers the most cost effective and latest technology to our clients.
    Carbon dioxide (CO2) is naturally formed in fermentation processes commonly found in the beer and alcohol production industries.
    CO2 is essential in the production of carbonated alcoholic beverages such as beers and ciders.
    Studies have indicated that a CO2 collection ratio of 27.3 kg/kl brewed is typical. In theory for high gravity Beer up to 45 kg/kl CO2 are generated, this figure is dependent on the actual brew.
    The CO2 gas stream is then compressed and purified to produce high quality food grade CO2."
    ref: http://www.co2plants.co.za/

    "In Tassie food-grade CO2 refills costs $40.00 for 2kg and $20.00 for 500grams."


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